Arrogant English

[Steven]

"The English are always arrogant in their attitude," Castaignede told the BBC Sport website. "Martin Johnson and all those guys are a bit arrogant.

"But you need to understand that it's in their culture. They don't have the same way of thinking as us.

"The English press are arrogant. They were saying 'let's go to the final and smash the All Blacks and that will be the only difficult point for us during the World Cup'.

"I think the French got a bit irritated by that and now they have the opportunity to show something, so that's why they are getting excited."

Source: http://rugbyheaven.smh.com.au/articles/2003/11/12/1068329632992.html

Eh? This school of thought that declares 'all english people: are really arrogant', wrankles. It's not just the French rugby players who advocate this generalisation, but from areas outside sport. I've heard mumblings of 'english arrogance' from islamic fundamentalists, scots and Aussies. Apparentely, we are all arrogant.

Why? What did we do? Rule the world for a bit? Sorry that doesn't count. We messed that up a century back.

We are a race of Angles, Jutes, Francs, Vikings and even dutch (east anglia) and many more. Where does the arrogance come from? The air?

Why are our rugby players arrogant? We play to win. We don't believe that playing fancy side-to-side passing game, no matter what the circumstances, is a good way to acheive the objective of winning. It's not arrogance, its strategy and execution of said strategy.

I'm glad we beat the French. You play beautiful rugby - we play to win.

They give out trophies for the latter.


Steve (arrogant)

[Dunc]

Seems to me this 'arrogant English' thing is a press beat-up around certain remarks that Woodward likes to make.

I think Johnson's post-match comments have been realistic and courteous eg (to an interviewer after the Samoan game), 'Don't patronise the Samoans - they could have beaten us.'

I'd be surprised indeed if he and the English team are in fact suffering from the delusion that a World Cup final is a foregone conclusion. If they feel confident, bully for them - I'll gladly grant them overdog status. But that's not the same thing as arrogance.

Australia and England have been the two teams slowest to wake up against less formidable opposition. Until this last weekend, both did just enough to win. Now they're both awake, and they both know it. Roll on next weekend! Regards / Dunc

[Harry R]

I think we should all just be realistic enough to recognise the elements of truth in our own stereotypes. The English are somewhat arrogant - there's a whole (generally unspoken) assumption of superiority. We're also emotionally constipated.

I imagine one reason the arrogance annoys the French is that they're exactly the same.

While we're at it, we should point out the genuine chippiness of Australians, and the (generally spoken) arrogance of Americans.

Anyone I've missed out?

Harry

[Rob Mackenzie]

Originally posted by Harry R


Anyone I've missed out?

Harry

You missed out the Scots, Harry - at least when it comes to snooker and whisky.

And we're even worse when it comes to beer. At least our snooker and whisky are good.

And, of course, if we're on any other subject, we have an inferiority complex, which, to an alien, would be indistinguishable from arrogance.

Rob

[Dunc]

Y'know, I really wish the Scots would choose another rugby anthem than The Flour of Scotland - oops, Flower. On the one hand, I remain totally unconvinced that the waltz is the way to express any strong emotion except genteel lust. On the other, the whole [expletive deleted] song defines Scotland as not-England. Respectfully, that's just dumb.

And me with the Scots as my default team! Cripes! / Dunc

[Harry R]

Originally posted by Dunc McReil
Y'know, I really wish the Scots would choose another rugby anthem than The Flour of Scotland - oops, Flower. On the one hand, I remain totally unconvinced that the waltz is the way to express any strong emotion except genteel lust. On the other, the whole [expletive deleted] song defines Scotland as not-England. Respectfully, that's just dumb.

And while we're at it, England need our own song, instead of the National Anthem. Jerusalem, or Hearts of Oak or something.

Harry

http://www.rmstitanichistory.com/lyrics/lyrics_c.html

[Rob Mackenzie]

Well, I’d submit this as the Scottish National Anthem. It’s about time we broke with the tradition of nations using songs about kings and queens and battles.

It was upon a Lammas night
When corn rigs are bonie.
Beneath the moon’s unclouded light
I held awa to Annie:
The time flew by, wi’ tentless heed,
Till ‘tween the late and early;
Wi’ sma’ persuasion she agreed,
To see me thro’ the barley.

Chorus:
Corn rigs and barley rigs,
An corn rigs are bonie:
I’ll never forget that happy night,
Amang the rigs wi’ Annie.

I hae been blithe wi’ Comrades dear;
I hae been merry drinking;
I hae been joyfu’ gath’ring gear:
I hae been happy thinking;
But a’ the pleasures e’er I saw,
Tho’ three times doubl’d fairly,
That happy night was worth them a’,
Amang the rigs o’ barley.

Chorus:

Robert Burns – “Song”

For Australia, I’d suggest something by Rolf Harris. He is such an ambassador for your musical and lyrical heritage. I was talking recently to a woman I know here from Ghana, and I happened to mention Rolf. I started explaining who Rolf was and what he did, when she interrupted me and told me that Rolf was famous in Ghana and that everyone knew all about him. So you’d have a national song with an international following.

And for England? I’m still thinking about that one.

Rob

[Dunc]

Rob

That's not bad as a national anthem - the barley's on-side too.

But when it comes to rugby, maybe it's the wrong message. After all, there's a school of thought in Sydney at the moment that says the Frogs would have been well advised to scrap their wives-and-companions-if-you-make-the-semis rule.

Regards / Dunc
[SIZE=1]Nothing like The Ball of Kirriemuir to get the stadium rocking.[/SIZE]

[Dunc]

Harry -

Something like Lusty Young Smith (http://www-cs.canisius.edu/~salley/Bard.book/jingle.html)?

Regards / Dunc
[SIZE=1]Laying a trap for Saturday[/SIZE]

[Rob Mackenzie]

Well, we tried having “Scotland the Brave” a few years back. The trouble was, no one knew the words, and at football matches all you could hear was “Na na nana na na na. Na na nana na na na etc…”

I was thinking about a new English national anthem.
How about “Everything I do, I do it for you” by Bryan Adams. I have several reasons for this suggestion;

Think how patriotic you could feel singing it to your country. The title says it all.
It was the theme song from Robin Hood; Prince of Thieves and therefore encapsulates all that’s great about England – men in green skirts cavorting around the forest and stealing from the rich to give to the poor – that sort of thing.
It was Number 1 for more weeks than any other song in history and thus is perfectly in tune with where England is at.
It’s not very good. I wouldn’t want England to have a better tune than the Scots.
The pinnacle of anyone’s ambition must be to write the English national anthem. Bryan Adams is Canadian, and this is an opportunity of a lifetime for Canada finally to make its mark on the world.
English arrogance? How arrogant could an English man/woman be if this was the national anthem? An instant cure.

Rob

[Donner]

At the very least, it should be as impossible to sing as the US national anthem.

I've seen many a grown man almost lose his manhood trying to hit those high notes on "rockets' red glare" and "land of the freeeeee[size=1]eeeeeeee[/size]".

Donner

[Kaltica]

[color=red]Rob MacKenzie said:[/color]

The pinnacle of anyone’s ambition must be to write the English national anthem.
For sure. Why, I myself have thought of nothing but for lo these last four decades.

Bryan Adams is Canadian,
Oh, sure. Rub it in, why don't you?

and this is an opportunity of a lifetime for Canada finally to make its mark on the world.
And here we've been wasting so much of our time in this country developing insulin, time zones, 911 numbers, the Canadarm, the cell phone, AM radio, IMAX projector and system, panoramic pictures and camera, the telephone, the transceiver (walkie-talkie), commercial motion picture, electric cooking ranges, Pablum, the jolly jumper, paint rollers, Robertson screws, the washing machine, the zipper, degradable plastic, kerosene, pulp newsprint, the sewage recycling system, the dental mirror, the electron microscope, liposomes, myoelectric prosthesis, the MacPherson gas mask, Balderdash, basketball, hockey, North American football, 5-pin bowling, rollerskates, Trivial Pursuit, the air-conditioned vehicle, the guardrail, the snowblower, the snowmobile, the wonderbra, the V-chip, cable TV, the Geiger Counter, Candu nuclear power reactors, flight simulators for pilot training, etc.

While Canada has a lot to answer for in regards to its contributions to music--most notably Celine Dion, Shania Twain, Ann Murray and the aforementioned Bryan Adams--it more than balanced the ledger with Leonard Cohen, Ferron, Bruce Cockburn, Gordon Lightfoot, Neil Young, Loreena McKennitt, the incomparable national treasure known as Stan Rogers and, more recently, Lennie Gallant. Most countries would be proud to claim even two such talents.

[Rob Mackenzie]

I believe Canadians are good at curling too.

[prokopton]

Yay, Robertson screws!

let's have an anthem about them.

- would really confuse the immigrants.

[River Not]

Originally posted by Rob Mackenzie
You missed out the Scots, Harry - at least when it comes to snooker and whisky.

And we're even worse when it comes to beer. At least our snooker and whisky are good.

And, of course, if we're on any other subject, we have an inferiority complex, which, to an alien, would be indistinguishable from arrogance.

Rob

good drink:

http://www.jameson.ie/img/lounge-bottle.jpg


heck, it's from over *there* anyway

[Harry R]

Originally posted by River Not
heck, it's from over *there* anyway

actually, to be pedantic about it, Jameson is an Irish whiskey, not a Scottish whisky. Nice, though.

Harry

[prokopton]

:)
see, Harry?

Now that's just the sort of thing that gets the English that "arrogant" reputation?
heh.

But I'll forgive you.

Geoff

[River Not]

Harry,

you had to of seen this one coming:

spots (ps?) (http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/YKS/Misc/Books/FolkTalk/Chapter11.html)


dern chase.

[Lola Two]

River,

Forgive my bemused intrusion, but did you intend to post a link to a page about Martinmas and a mysterious practice saddled with the unfortunate name "statties"? I tried to read it, but frankly...blah blah blah boring-cakes.

Lola
did I miss something?

[River Not]

Originally posted by Lola Two
River,

blah blah blah boring-cakes.

Lola
did I miss something?

it's a Dørker kinda thing, I guess?

with such sentences as this:

"The only thing that can he adduced in favour of such a time is that farm work is then at the slackest."

I, for one, am seeing SubGenius influence, but maybe my Slack's (http://xenia.media.mit.edu/~mt/subg/subg.html) gone awry, again.




But if I'm still boring you, Lola, just gimme a second. I've got another snakey-snake story for you if you like those better, but it might not fit "properly" in this thread...

[Lola Two]

Oh, no, do go ahead. You are quite useful. I have now incorporated "statties" into my everyday speech, although I have creatively broadened its definition to fit my own purposes.

Lola

[River Not]

Originally posted by Lola Two
You are quite useful.


muskull. !




RN,
being errorgant,
yet sensing the crop.